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#52649 - Wed Jan 20 2010 22:38 PM PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST
EUBS Offline
New Member

Registered: Wed Jan 20 2010
Posts: 5
Loc: DYESS AFB, TX
When a person tries out for a guard or reserve PJ unit, the PAST test is somewhat equivalent to that of the PT eval halfway through INDOC?? I've only heard that their PAST is a 3mile run, 1500m swim.. followed by an interview if you pass. Is there any truth to this? Do other units have their own version they use to screen potential candidates?

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#52650 - Thu Jan 21 2010 05:19 AM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: EUBS]
moe Offline
Operator

Registered: Sun Aug 17 2008
Posts: 19
Loc: Arizona
Each ANG/reserve unit has their own tryout criteria. Most of these units have more difficult standards than the basic PAST test. The 306th does 3 mile run, cals, 1500 swim, 2 or more underwaters, then a smoke session of varying sorts. These teams are hiring a potential teammate and that teammate will take up a rare slot they have at INDOC. They have to make sure they hire someone who should make it and is compatible with the team.

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#52651 - Thu Jan 21 2010 06:20 AM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: moe]
RRaymond Offline
New Member

Registered: Mon Jan 26 2009
Posts: 64
Loc: NY
The 103rd RQS Pre-Indoctrination PAST is as follows: 4 x 25m underwaters in 10 min followed by a 5 min rest. 1500m fin in 30 min or less followed by a 30 min rest. 3 mile run in 22:30 or less followed by a 10 min rest. 10 or more pullups in 1 min, 3 min rest, 65 or more situps in 2 min, 3 min rest, 50 or more pushups in 2 min, 3 min rest, 60 or more flutter kicks in 2 min. Keep in mind that these are the MINIMUM requirements.
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#52652 - Thu Jan 21 2010 10:00 AM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: moe]
EUBS Offline
New Member

Registered: Wed Jan 20 2010
Posts: 5
Loc: DYESS AFB, TX
Originally Posted By: moe
teammate will take up a rare slot they have at INDOC.


You would think with all the slots the AF throws away at new airman coming into the military that may or may not be able to pass the PAST test, the AF would give these reserve and ANG units all the slots they could ever want... which brings up another question.

As with CROs, and Phase II, why dosen't Pararescue hold that sort of course for at least retrainees? As with CROs you think this would better prepare someone to make it through INDOC. After randomly researching information about Pararescue I came across the Civil Air Patrol offered course of APJOC. I wish I would have known about that... The Seals even have a course for randoms to spend ALOT of money to go to just to see if they can make it.

At my current base we were fortunate to have A CMSgt and one of the instructors of the CCT school house come up just to teach us the proper way to do cals, then they took us on a run. After we had a meeting about CCT, PJ and I thought it was the greatest, most motivating event just to see these people and ask them questions... About a cuople weeks later they held a "PAST test challenge" and if you passed they gave you the t-shirt. Why can't Pararescue hold events like that. Or do you but just in the local areas around your bases?! There are soooo many people out there that like the idea of PJ or CCT but they just don't know enough about it.

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#52658 - Thu Jan 21 2010 18:43 PM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: EUBS]
Yukon Online
Operator

Registered: Wed Mar 14 2001
Posts: 2056
Loc: Anchorage AK, USA
Originally Posted By: EUBS

You would think with all the slots the AF throws away at new airman coming into the military that may or may not be able to pass the PAST test, the AF would give these reserve and ANG units all the slots they could ever want...
What makes you believe the Air Guard and AF Reserve STS and RQS units don’t get all the slots they could ever want to Indoc, the pipeline courses and the Pararescue school? Better yet, why do you think each of the Air Force Reserve PJ Squadrons and Air Guard STS and PJ squadrons run their own selection screening of prospective new PJ/CTT members of their unit before they sign them up? The answer is the training mandays and other training costs come directly out of these units annual budget. This means these units and not the Air Force have a significant vested interest in not throwing away money like you would like them to.

Originally Posted By: EUBS

At my current base we were fortunate to have A CMSgt and one of the instructors of the CCT school house come up just to teach us the proper way to do cals, then they took us on a run. After we had a meeting about CCT, PJ and I thought it was the greatest, most motivating event just to see these people and ask them questions... About a cuople weeks later they held a "PAST test challenge" and if you passed they gave you the t-shirt. Why can't Pararescue hold events like that.
Because for every prospective applicant CCT gets, pararescue gets 4-5. Pararescue has no difficulty getting prospective applicants, never has. The problem has been getting prospective applicants through the required AFSC awarding training.

Interesting fact 1: “Cardiorespiratory endurance in young men has declined by approximately 10 percent since 1966, whereas there was no change for young women during the same period.” (DoD Committee on Youth Population and Military Recruitment: Physical, Medical, and Mental Health Standards, 2005).

Interesting fact 2: Heat Stroke is similar to High Altitude Cerebral Edema and High Altitude Pulmonary edema in the first episode makes one more susceptive to recurrence when in the same environment. Heat Stroke and High Altitude Cerebral Edema also have common cause of the brain stops working properly to adapt body to environment. In this way Heat Stroke differs considerably from heat exhaustion (loss of fluids through sweating).

Interesting fact 3: Air Force has visited many of the suggestions you are making, the outcome has never reduced the amount of money wasted on prospective PJ applicants who fail PAST on the first day of Indoc or the money wasted on prospective PJ applicants who get involuntarily eliminated (medical, inability to do training events to standards) or voluntarily self eliminate themselves out of training.

Considering you have gone to Indoc twice, didn’t successfully compete the course either time and got eliminated supposedly for Heat Stroke the second time, how is it reasonable probability your participating in a PAST test challenge event prior to getting to indoc would have resulted in any different outcome?

The Civil Air Patrol’s Pararescue Orientation Course (PJOC) and Advanced Pararescue Orientation Course (APJOC) are primarily for adolescent cadets (15-18 years of age) of both genders (see fact 1). These courses are not designed to have any intended purpose to be a preparatory PJ indoc selection course. These courses have no intent to train adults to have certification and qualification perform rescue duties.

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#52660 - Thu Jan 21 2010 19:13 PM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: Yukon]
Yukon Online
Operator

Registered: Wed Mar 14 2001
Posts: 2056
Loc: Anchorage AK, USA
Originally Posted By: moe
These teams are hiring a potential teammate and that teammate will take up a rare slot they have at INDOC. They have to make sure they hire someone who should make it and is compatible with the team.
Yes the unit hire decision maker is hiring a prospective member of the team.

A slot is rare at indoc due to many reasons such as the Air Guard PJ or STS Squadron or the Air Force Reserve PJ squadron can only hire for vacancies existing on their Unit Manning Document. The second reason is each reserve component unit has to submit a forecast budget of how many training man-days and other pay and training monies it will need each years to fill known or expected empty unfilled positions existing on it Unit Manning Document.

The rarity of a slot the unit has at Indoc is caused by training resources limitation of the Pararescue School and required pipeline courses having maximum capability to train 120 students each fiscal year. Thus active duty Air Force, Air Guard, and Air Force Reserve all must negotiate their requirements.

“ … and is compatible with the team” is too vauge and opens too much speculating on what compatible means. The initial entry enlistment, whether active duty, Air Guard, or Air Force Reserves is an eight year obligation. The assessment (for Air Guard and AF Reserve) of being there participating and contributing in performing Pararescue or CCT duties once awarded the AFSC is the second, third, and forth screening and selecting considerations after does this person have strong probability potential to complete all required training and do they have the willingness and commitment to do it within the allotted course schedule.

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#52661 - Thu Jan 21 2010 22:12 PM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: Yukon]
EUBS Offline
New Member

Registered: Wed Jan 20 2010
Posts: 5
Loc: DYESS AFB, TX
"What makes you believe the Air Guard and AF Reserve STS and RQS units don’t get all the slots they could ever want to Indoc, the pipeline courses and the Pararescue school?"

What makes me believe, is the post that was made by Moe. 'rare slot at INDOC' would make a person believe there are limited numbers of slots for ANG/Reserve units. It makes sense that they can only send people if the money in a units annual budget allows them too. I always hear that Pararescue is hurting for people. I'm typing slowly trying to watch what I say because I know your gonna pick it apart again... If Pararescue IS hurting for people, an individual would think there would be a better more efficient way to get people through the pipeline. Or is the one in place the most efficient?

"Air Force has visited many of the suggestions you are making"

How come people like me who look for things like this to go to never hear about them. Have they tried but didn't get the results they wanted then stopped because it wasn't worth the effort?

"how is it reasonable probability your participating in a PAST test challenge event prior to getting to indoc would have resulted in any different outcome?"

There is no reasonalbe probability. Is it too much to suggest the PAST provides the minimum physical requirements to a potential candidate in order to enter into one of these programs? I think the point of the PAST test challenge was to introduce those participating to what training might be like when it came to those career fields. Most people, even those currently retraining have no idea what to expect. Some people make INDOC out to be the impossible. But you got through it. If you can I can right?! We got a small taste. It was a great event, and I would go to it again tomorrow if I had the chance.

CAP POC was something I came across that I wish I knew about... when I was younger. I would have killed to do that. Do you think that a Phase II sort of thing would be a good idea for retrainees Yukon? I realise it will take more money, but then again, a retrainees unit can provide the money to go TDY. I know that doesn't help ANG/RES units because they will end up spending more money... But better to have someone go through a Phase II sort of thing rather then going straight to INDOC, like I did, and waste peoples time and money right?!

Is it impossible to make it through INDOC after suffering a heat stroke? When a person has taken counter measures to prevent this from happening again by preparing oneself A LOT MORE then when this happened, I believe so. I guess I will have to prove it. If the road I've taken drags me through the mud, kicks me in the balls, should I quit? Or does it make someone like me want to do it even more, better yet make someone like me have to do it. I may not know about Pararescue like you YUKON, but that is why i'm here. I'm looking forward to how your going to rape my post!!

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#52662 - Thu Jan 21 2010 23:04 PM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: EUBS]
Kaibil Offline
New Member

Registered: Mon Nov 30 2009
Posts: 71
Loc: Texas, USA
I just talked with a buddy of mine in who is in the guard with the Combat weathermen in DFW, and he told me that their past is 3 miles in 24 minutes, 1500 meters in 34 minutes, 45 push ups in 2 minutes, 8 CHIN UPS (not pull ups) in 2 minutes, and 60 sit ups in 4 minutes. Oh, and the swim is with fins with any stroke. So, I guess everyone has their own thing.
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#52663 - Fri Jan 22 2010 00:40 AM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: Kaibil]
Yukon Online
Operator

Registered: Wed Mar 14 2001
Posts: 2056
Loc: Anchorage AK, USA
You certainly are rationalizing the roots of your two failures being external to yourself. I’m in no need to rape your post. I will however expose your irrational attribution bias excuses as example of a self-serving character trait that really needs being the victim as the reason for failures. Thus I will address some of your concerns and irrational bias.

The active duty Air Force and its reserve components (Air National Guard & AF Reserves) select and screen prospective PJ and CCT applicants on standards derived from frequency of encountering occurrences of physical, mental, and emotional hardships, perils, adversities, duress combined with medical research into medical conditions that are disqualifying as they have adverse effects on mission performance or pose increase loss of life or limb of self or others while being there performing duties whether it be participating in training or accomplishing a mission tasking.

Yes Pararescue is always hurting for people who posses the ability, capability, and willingness to fully participate in performing pararescue duties, whether it be the training needed to sustain mission readiness, upgrade training, or being employed to accomplish a mission. However, in this regard “Quality not Quantity” has been verified and validated over and over again. It is better not to have 100% manning than to ignore standards and fill vacancies with unfit and unqualified (mediocrity) accidents waiting to happen. It’s not your right or entitlement to be a PJ, it is the qualified PJs expectation to have confidence themselves and their team members are trained, qualified, capable and able to be there participating in doing the mission. More importantly command authority giving the execute the mission order don't want to be second guessing fitness and qualifications of team leaders and team members, they demand consistancy and dependability.

To answer your question, the current selection and screening process in place has been in place since 1964. It gets improvement tweaks and adjustments, but it has consistently been demonstrated to be both the most effective and efficient process possible. The Air Force has never been happy with the high failure rate and it is on a continuous quest to find away to get it within Air Force norms. Concurrently the combat air forces and joint commands wants and desperately needs the capability and ability that makes it through indoc/selection and subsequently through all the other required AFSC awarding courses.

Concerning your question as to why people like you who look for things like this never hear about them. Well the answer is simply this has appearances of failures to make the effort to look.

Examples:
http://www.specialtactics.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/52344/Re_Graduate_s.html#Post52344

http://www.specialtactics.com/ubbthreads....html#Post52056

http://www.specialtactics.com/ubbthreads....html#Post51666

http://www.specialtactics.com/ubbthreads....html#Post51003

Regarding the PAST, are you given such an orientation when you enter Kindergarten, High School, or College/University? How about when an employer hires you? The purpose of the PAST and the PAST challenge does no orientation or introducing to what training might be like. Its sole purpose is to give a standard that must be met to have eligibility to get the additional indoctrination to be prepared to get trained. The first required course to become a PJ is the 9-week Pararescue Indoctrination Course. In the old days it was called the Pararescue selection and Indoctrination Course. Selection was dropped when GTEP contract and passing the PAST to get the contract allowed presumption to be made all the applicant arriving at Indoc needed is indoctrination. Pertinent to this the course’s stronger focus has become indoctrinated performance improvement and less screening and selecting focused (some old school PJs of OL-J and combined PJ/CCT OL-H run courses will reminisce the course was much more effective and efficient in producing quality when screening, selecting and indoctrinating had equal importance). Regardless you are looking for a nobody fails course and in truth very few actually fail these days, most self eliminate and most of the others who involuntarily get eliminated are disqualified for medical conditions that surface or cannot be kept hidden while participating in the Indoc course training.

This again bring us back to heat stroke. Correct me if I’m mistaken, you were eliminated from training during your second attempt to get through the Indoc because of an incident of Heat Stroke? As I previously stated heat stroke is a nervous system failure. Although lack of body fluids and overexposure to high temperatures can bring about heat stroke, exercise or exertion is often not the contributing cause. How you correctly or incorrectly performed exercises has no contributing cause to being stricken with an incident of heat stroke. I also have some difficulty in what proven counter measures correct an already reliable history of having an abnormally lowered heat tolerance threshold. What I do know is AFI 48-123 discloses the following pertinent cause for systematic and miscellaneous causes for FCII and FCIII rejection:

“6.44.30.1.13. Heat pyrexia (heat stroke or heat exhaustion) if a reliable history indicates an abnormally lowered heat tolerance threshold.” Thus it seems to me you will need a medical waiver.

Your proposition of it being “better to have someone go through a Phase II sort of thing rather then going straight to INDOC, like I did, and waste peoples time and money right?!” Holds no water as: (1) you were ultimately eliminated for a disqualifying medical condition that was discovered during training; and, (2) most people self eliminate even though they have the physical ability and capability to do the physical training.

What upsets you is you are now doing some other job for the Air Force and in this capacity the Air Force is getting its money worth out of you.

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#52664 - Fri Jan 22 2010 01:31 AM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: Yukon]
EUBS Offline
New Member

Registered: Wed Jan 20 2010
Posts: 5
Loc: DYESS AFB, TX
I'm not denying it wasn't my fault, I take full responsibility for what happened. Even though I felt really horrible while it happening, I didn't want to quit. I tried to keep going till I couldn't anymore.. If my physical ability at the time wasn't any where that it needed to be, performing exercises in high temperatures and dehydrated, wouldn't my lack of strength bring my body temperature up, being a contributing factor to my heat stroke? I have no doubt in my mind that you know what your talking about seeing that you have been around this community far longer than I have been alive. Raping my post may have been the wrong wording, rather disect, maybe even misinterpret some of my post. The links you have so graciously provided are about the PAST yes, but what I was refering to are events to help the rest of us who do not know very much about Pararescue. Examples: At Tico airport in Titusville, FL the PJs at Patrick had a display with some of the equipment they use and PJs were there to answer any questions anyone had. In Daytona Beach, FL Pjs held a demostration in the ocean via helicopters rescuing victims. Cape Canaveral, FL during a Airshow PJs did the same demo. Sorry I'm from FL and those are the events I've been to except a CCT demo at Lackland where they jumped from a helicopter. What's the point of all this babbling? Advertising brings about curiousity and then education on what these career fields offer. I would just like to see something like this for retrainees. Kindergarden, high school, working in a office don't have an orientation, well except that job I had at Ryan's, but Pararescue is not like any of these things. When I was at INDOC last we had around 120 people start the PAST the first day. A little over HALF remained the 2nd day. I think they graduated around 15 or something like that. I don't think a PAST will give me any validation into my chances of success in INDOC, not a regular PAST anyways. But a PAST given by a RES/GUARD unit for their selection might. If I can reinforce my confidence in my ability by passing a selection PAST (if that's what its called) then I will be better off. The doctor at Wilford hall said I have to wait 6 months to put in another package. I was told by another person that I have to go to the Flight Doctor after 6 months to revalidate my IFC III. I also have to provide a Exception to policy waiver for my next package. Your right about the job except hate wasn't added into that. I'm extremely un happy with my job, but that doesn't mean my job performance slacks. I will do whatever job I'm given to the best of my ability. The AF is getting more than there moneys worth...

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#52665 - Fri Jan 22 2010 11:39 AM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: EUBS]
Yukon Online
Operator

Registered: Wed Mar 14 2001
Posts: 2056
Loc: Anchorage AK, USA
Well, I'm glad you stepped up to the bar with a slightly different direction of discussion. Now lets put heat stroke in its proper perspective, it is an incident you had no control over as I have repeatedly stated heat stroke is the brain going haywire, sort of similar to a combustion engine in a car or truck misfiring or unable to idle properly. The difference between the brain going haywire and the engine is preventive maintenance and regular maintenance can prevent the problem from happening in a mechanical engine. Not so with Heat Stroke, there is no test to determine the prospect of it preexisting (other than presence of a few linked diseases that can be diagnosed).

The curriculum of the Pararescue Indoctrination Course and its instructors have specific risk mitigation curriculum protocol and risk control measures pertinent to all training activities that expose students to potential risk of Heat Stroke, Heat exhaustion, Hyperthermia and many more hazards, dangers, and activities that could cause a student harm. Thus you or anybody else can have confidence it was not a poorly implemented training activity that caused the incident of Heat Stroke. Unfortunately an occurrence of Heat Stroke does cause a medical disqualification and you are doing all you can do by getting an exception to policy and medical review and evaluation. The other unfortunate is there is nothing I or anybody else on these forums can do to help you get to Indoc nor is there anything that can be changed to improve chance of you or anybody else getting through Indoc.

As far as improving awareness of Pararescue and what is required to become a PJ/CCT/SOWT/SERE/TACP, this site was created by TE specifically for that purpose and all the info needed can be found either on the main website or by asking questions here. In addition the Air Force currently advertises Pararescue and CCT more than any other specific AFSC, the Air Force Recruiting service has more guidance and information about Pararescue and CCT than the majority of jobs the Air Force offers.

Regarding PAST and the Pararescue Indocrination Course. PAST is a measurement tool. Being able to demonstrate ability to pass the PAST verifies the applicant has the level of fitness ability to enter a regime of indoctrinated (means there is an end standard goal) performance improvement. Studies, research and student production assessment verify if applicant can pass the PAST it will take nine weeks of performance improvement training to get applicants at the level of fitness needed to safely participate in all subsequent training and at the doing ability level where focus is on learning rather than struggling to do training activities. The baseline fitness entrance into PJ/CCT training standards are always set at the typical or average core components of cardiorespiratory endurance (aerobic fitness), muscular strength, muscular endurance, flexibility, and body composition existing in the current 17-21 year old male civilian population.

Consequently, being able to pass the PAST is a personal responsibility. The PAST is very publically disclosed and explained. Whether applying for an active duty or reserve component PJ or CCT job it is not the absolute knowing nothing about the requirement or even not knowing enough about the requirements, it is the vast number of applicants who ignore all the information being provided because they believe they can easily handle the training and deny themselves doing any preparation. Once most applicants pass their PAST they fail to sustain or improve upon that level of fitness and their reasoning is most often justified by the most often irrational opinion that there is a waiver for everything. Well, there isn’t a waiver for lack of personal responsibility and unwillingness to be accountable to standards for entry into the Pararescue and CCT AFSCs. The PJ/CCT applicant meets standards or finds another job.

Your situation and cirumstances is no longer the PAST, it is your incident of Heat Stroke and as I previously stated, I and nobody else here can help you with that obstacle.

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#52667 - Fri Jan 22 2010 11:58 AM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: EUBS]
moe Offline
Operator

Registered: Sun Aug 17 2008
Posts: 19
Loc: Arizona
First let me say that I comment on topics which I have knowledge of or may be able to add some substance. There are many on this board with vastly more experience as a PJ than I. So I keep my posts to only things I feel I can add some value.

I recently went through the 306th tryouts. During my interview process, I had several PJ's and CRO's ask me lots of questions to gauge my reasons for returning; my motivation, how I view younger PJ's, my family situation, etc. My opinion is that they were doing this to gauge my compatibility with the team. I think guard and reserve teams must put a higher emphasis on this because you are going to be at that unit for your entire enlistment working around all the guys that are on that team.

When a reserve team "accepts" you after a tryout, you now are a reflection of that team and that teams leadership. Therefore they make significant effort to make sure that you are prepared for the rigors of training that lie ahead. I feel this is a significant advantage for PJ hopefuls. Drop out rates for guard and reserve units are substantially less and I feel the guard/reserve process of harder tryouts, individual training and being a reflection of that team is why.

That being said, I do wish there was some type of mechanicism available to all PJ hopefuls similar to what guard/reserve teams offer. I'm not knowledgeable enough to offer specific solutions. I just use my experiences and those of others I'm close to as a gauge to comment on what might work.

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#52670 - Fri Jan 22 2010 19:18 PM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: moe]
NickP Offline
Member

Registered: Thu Jul 26 2007
Posts: 306
Loc: Alaska
The newest AF recruiting commercial is PJs on a rescue mission..
_________________________
Quitting Hurts.... Bad!!! Regret Hurts Worse!
www.unitedstatesairman.com for Air Force information

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#52673 - Sat Jan 23 2010 00:51 AM Re: PARARESCUE Guard/Reserve PAST [Re: NickP]
Yukon Online
Operator

Registered: Wed Mar 14 2001
Posts: 2056
Loc: Anchorage AK, USA
Originally Posted By: moe


That being said, I do wish there was some type of mechanicism available to all PJ hopefuls similar to what guard/reserve teams offer.
The logistics of number of applicants makes it impossible for the active duty. The smaller size of the end user reserve component organization doing recruitment and selection for its own needs does not have the placement problems of a global active duty Air Force.

Not only does the reserve components give the boss access to interview, size up, and let his gut reaction guide the choice, the success rate statistics of getting a prospective applicant through indoc and the rest of the required AFSC awarding courses reflect only applicants that pass the PAST given by the boss or his designated representative, but also the applicants that made it through all the other interviews.

The Reserve components if one looks at numbers that show for PAST and fail or if pass the PAST and don’t make the interview cut are similar to the percentages that show up to Indoc on the active side of the house and SIE or fail out for one reason or another. The reason the active duty failures get heard from is because this means either they get administratively separated or classified into another AFSC. This makes them unhappy enough to motivate them to publish their story and a request for help them get a second chance on the forums. The reserve component failure has no military obligation commitment until boss says we would like to hire and train you. Thus these persons seldom advertise their failure on the forums.

Originally Posted By: moe
I think guard and reserve teams must put a higher emphasis on this because you are going to be at that unit for your entire enlistment working around all the guys that are on that team.
The preliminary screening interviews can be both more structured and reliable because the small numbers and less frequency of dealing with applicants gives the small in need of filling vacancies reserve component units’ time to do it. The compatibility being gauged is the potential to be an effective contributing participating member of the unit once all the training dollars are spent to get a 3-skill level PJ. Personality type being looked at is dependability and potential to work well with others after the 3-skill level is awarded.

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#52723 - Fri Jan 29 2010 16:32 PM Pararescue [Re: EUBS]
randallwaynetimmons Offline
New Member

Registered: Wed Nov 25 2009
Posts: 1
Does Pararescue still take volunteers in BMT?
My name is Randall Timmons I signed a 6 year contract doing Security Forces in the Air Force Reserve. I leave for BMT March 9th and have been doing alot of PT and swimming, to pass the PAST. I was told that BMT is the only place to take the test by my recruiter. I was asking questions on Yahoo Answers and a PJ told me that they no longer ask for volunteers in BMT, then recomended me to this site. I've done all the searching I could to find an answer here but found nothing. PJ is my dream job and I work very hard to get what I want. But it's very hard to get to where I want to be if I'm misinformed. Also do you need to have prior service to join Pararescue? The reason I'm asking is that when I looked on this website and found the downloadable packets. I've looked through them and it says you need letters of recomendation, etc. I'm sorry for any mistakes I've made. I'm still trying to find my way around this site. Thanks for any help.

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#52724 - Fri Jan 29 2010 18:59 PM Re: Pararescue [Re: randallwaynetimmons]
Yukon Online
Operator

Registered: Wed Mar 14 2001
Posts: 2056
Loc: Anchorage AK, USA
You are property of the Air Force Reserve. Even in the old days there was no mechanism of switching to active duty at BMT.

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#52725 - Fri Jan 29 2010 21:23 PM Re: Pararescue [Re: Yukon]
TE Offline
Operator

Registered: Thu Oct 17 2002
Posts: 4132
Loc: Various
Timmons,

They are no longer taking volunteers at BMT. Your recruiter should know that you can come in guaranteed PJ (GTEP)...the process is to join, go to MEPS for a physical and job selection, take the PAST then change your contract to PJ...it may be too late for that now but your recruiter should know this...if not, have him contact a ST recruiter...they're info is on the AF Recruiting COP (he'll know what that is)...he/she is misinformed regarding the process.

You do not have to be prior service.
_________________________
TE
Pararescueman (Ret)/Webmaster/Administrator/RKC
The real test comes when all strength has fled, and men must produce victory on will alone...

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#52728 - Sat Jan 30 2010 07:22 AM Re: Pararescue [Re: TE]
Guard MC Offline
Operator

Registered: Sat Aug 09 2003
Posts: 1865
Loc: Louisville, Ky STS
Timmons,
If you have enlisted in an Air Force Reserve Unit, your Recruiter is probably very knowledgable about the procedures and needs of that unit but may not be as up to date on the rest of the Air Force. Either they are woefully ill informed of the current Pararescue assessions process, or you are misinterpretting what they are telling you. In any case, Yukon and TE appear to be spot on. You have a contract with an AFRC unit so you can only become a Pararescueman if they release you from that contract to allow you to pursue a Pararescue contract elsewhere. You could also cross train after fullfilling your initial enlistment with that unit. The unit you have joined has little incentive to release you from your Security Forces contract unless the unit also has a Prarescue Squadron, in which case they would almost certainly accomodate you. They may choose to release you, if you explain your situation but they certainly are not under any obligation to do so. A hell of a lot goes into recruiting a person and they may not want to let all that effort be wasted. But you never know if you don't ask.

Another question is how sure are you that you CAN meet all the standards to be a PJ? The PAST and Class III Flight Physical are but two small criteria. There are a ton more criteria different from a Security Forces enlistment package.

How long can you afford to be in limbo, waiting for a Pararescue slot to drop? It could take a year or more to make the switch.

Good luck.
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