Below is what is says on the 13DX Officer Description:

"Education. For entry into this specialty, undergraduate academic specialization in a technical discipline with courses in administration and management is desirable."

My questions is what is considered a "technical discipline" Common sense tells me physics, chem. engr, stuff like that, but I did not know if anybody knew about a list that names the majors. Thanks for any replies.

STO's have a wide variety of Bachelor's. I think if you came in with a physics degree or a engineering dergree you might find it difficult for your functional manager to release you to the other career field.


SI

Thanks for the info. I am a PSYC major, so if I can apply, I should not really have a problem-Whole Person concept and all.

If you plan on going the OTS route, then a technical major will help you into the AF. If I am not mistaken, there is only one OTS board per year for non-technicals and its very competitive

Ok, I've got a lot of questions so please bear with me here....

Going over the STO Application, all I see under "eligibility" is this:
[]Eligibility criteria include:
• Be a male
• Security clearance: Secret (minimum), Top Secret-attainable
• Retain ability: Three years (minimum)
• Volunteer for Hazardous Duty: Parachute (Static-line and Freefall) and combat diver (SCUBA) duty
• Background: Outstanding resume and no negative personal history
Medical/Physical: Class III Flight Physical as outlined in this package (see Annex D)
• Physical Fitness: As a minimum, you must satisfactorily complete the minimum number of PT Evaluation
exercise repetitions and run and swim in less than the maximum allowable times (see Annex B) -- to be
competitive at Phase I and Phase II, you should perform well above the minimums[/]

Is there something I'm missing here? It looks like you don't have to have a technical major to apply.

I want to go to the USAFA or do ROTC, and apply for STO. I'm trying to pick a major that I'd enjoy, but that would still get me accepted into Phase II of the selection process. Are there any majors that you would suggest? I'm an EMT-B and I'd really like to get a masters in nursing- would that completely kill all prospects of me becoming a STO? Any advice here is much appreciated!

The EMT-B and Nursing would not hurt your chances of being a STO but boy would they HELP you at going CRO! If you are a medically oriented guy who wants to help people (and that's what it looks like to me), you've already done the PJOC which shows an interest in Pararescue, and you want the challenge and excitement of Special Operations, why not go the Combat Rescue Officer Route. Read up on it on the Home page, it seems more in line with what you've done so far and want to do in the future.

[]The EMT-B and Nursing would not hurt your chances of being a STO but boy would they HELP you at going CRO! If you are a medically oriented guy who wants to help people (and that's what it looks like to me), you've already done the PJOC which shows an interest in Pararescue, and you want the challenge and excitement of Special Operations, why not go the Combat Rescue Officer Route. Read up on it on the Home page, it seems more in line with what you've done so far and want to do in the future. [/]

I've gone back and forth between CRO and STO, but I'm leaning more on the side of STO because it seems to be a little bit more up my alley. However, I do realize that becoming a CRO would be incredibly awesome, and if I actually made it through selection, indoc, and the pipeline I would probably be the most happy guy alive. Taking a look at the CRO selection process, it seems pretty much identical to the STO selection process. Is it possible to apply to both at the same time? In my case, it would be my Junior year in either AFROTC or the USAFA. Thanks for the help!

I don't see why you couldn't apply for both.

There is no reason you can't apply for both, although if invited to both PII selections - I'd probably say that would be a good time to decide which way you are going. Doing PII twice in about a month....if you get thru both - you would surely be a stud...anyway, the selection boards will know that you have applied to both, your cover page would have to explain your rationale for trying to do both and the likely quetion is "do you want to be a CRO or a STO?

BTW - the nursing thing is not a big plus for CRO

Thank you both very much for the help. Other than nursing, are there any other majors that you would suggest that would be of use to an operator? What are some of the majors that are more common in CROs and STOs? Thanks again for the help!

I don't know of any Major that makes a difference unless you get a Bachelors in ATC (never heard of such a school). I've seen just about every Major from Math, to History, to Engineering. Either pick something you like, something you think has a future in the AF if you don't make it to STO or CRO or something with a future in Civie life.

If you can find a school that offers a degree in command and control or in federal disaster management / crisis action manamgent that would look great on a resume for CRO.

You might try Embry-Riddle main campus (www.erau.edu). They offer a wide variety of aviation focused courses and degree programs. I believe they even have a good ATC program.

I'm at the AF Academy. The only degree they award is a bachelor of science (i.e. if you major in management, you get a B.S.). Is a technical major actually important even though I'll be taking lots of engineering, math, chemistry, etc. in all my core courses regardless of whether or not I major in a technical field?

No, your Major is not that important. USAFA (and all the Academies) offer a varitety of Majors but the most important thing they offer is the Professional Development of the Cadets, the Major itself is secondary. In affect, you are double Majoring, emphasis on Military Studies with a secondary Major in your area of study and a Minor in what ever. The point of the Academy isn't so much education as teaching you a way of life, to live up to and be the very embodiment of everything the Officer Corps stands for. So, I'd say your Major is even less important as an Academy guy than ROTC or OCS guys. Having said that, I'm not saying that the Academy is going to make you a better STO or give you a better chance at STO Selection. What you do at Phase II and on your team determines your fate, not where you went to school.

One bit of advice if you go the AFROTC route. "Right now" if you are a nursing degree in AFROTC you must go into nursing in the AF. This is due to the shortage of nurses in the AF; active duty guys are seeing this, as it is really hard to be released from nursing to go CRO. I say "right now" because needs of the AF change constantly. Just a heads up and definitely talk to your cadre at your respective schools to get more info.

I can second that. I am a Lt in the Nurse Corp with no hope of being released any time soon. What I believe is the only way to get released from the nurse corp is to time your Phase I application and obtaining your release letter is to time it close to the end of your active duty commitment. But the only problem with that is what happens when your put in your application and then you do not get picked up for Phase II then you have to scramble to try to stay active duty at the last minute. But going Nurse to CRO has been done so there is still hope.

If you want to have a chance at getting selected to CRO/STO don't even think about being any type of engineering major, don't be a math major, a physical major, chemistry, medical, and more than likely, don't be meteorology. These will all place you in AFSCs that need you more.

My squadron recently had one of the heads of ACC communications selections. I had the chance to sit down with her and talk about my career track. According to her I'm going to have to bust my ----- to crosstrain. My squadron (612 ACOMS) is supposed to have 4-5 A-shreds or Communication Engineers. Instead we have me, who just PCSed here as and ACE Lt and another 2d Lt who is deployed to Qatar on his AEF cycle. Needless to say, they are clinging to me with a killer grip.

Be a business major, or if it has to be technical, be something low level... really low level.

Oh, and if you are at the Academy and a computer science major you are guaranteed to go Comm.

I do not agree with the above post. If you are attending school, then major in what you want. If you want to major in engineering then major in engineering. Technical majors do not hinder you, they actually will aid you in easier understanding of the radios and other systems. I know this because I majored in an engineering discipline. It might be a little more difficult than some other AFSC's to get a release to cross over, but it will get approved if you are a select from Phase II. In the last two-three selections, a CE guy, systems engr and weather guy got selected. The moral of the story is not to cop out on a weak major if you don't want to. If you want something bad enough and work at it, you will get it, regardless of AFSC.

Well then, get those guys to tell me their secret... cause I've been told that my dreams are dead.

Major in what you want, but start the process for STO/CRO as soon as you can IN COLLEGE. If you wait till you have an AFSC based on your major and you are in that career field then you have a steep hill to climb because you will have tech school class dates coming down and ASBC slots, and after all that they are definately going to be resistant to let you go. Keep in mind, intel school is insanely long, and I have to go to about 3 months of tech school...

I'm not trying to kill any hopes, because I'm in the same position right now trying to get out of it. I'm just trying to give some real hard advice instead of saying pursue your dreams and they'll come true like magic and unicorns

As I read down this thread, it addresses very much my own current concern. I'm completing my application for the Technical Degree Sponsorship Program, which will pay me as E-3 for two years until I graduate and go straight to OTS for a 4 year commitment as an electrical engineer. This is a very sweet deal, but I dream of doing special tactics. -I'd be happy to go back to engineering when I'm older, but I'm almost 27, and I'd like to do STO while I'm still young and agile.

I addressed this concern to some recruiters, and they (one especially) stated emphatically that although they didn't have direct knowledge of the process, they would be very surprised if I were not allowed the opportunity to apply for STO selection within the first one or two years of my commission. They were under the impression that the needs of special tactics had a lot of pull.

This contradicts what I read here, so I'm hoping that either things have changed in the last several years or that the views here might not be entirely accurate. Can anyone confirm this in some way?

As the STO application states, your careerfield manager has to release you for you to try for STO:

"As an Air Force officer, you must first obtain release from your AFPC functional manager in order to cross train into 13D. The ST Assessment Director has no authority to interfere with AFPC’s manning requirements. If invited to Phase II but ultimately not selected, you return to your previous assignment and career field."

So it really depends on your FAM and the needs of your careerfield and I will tell you that it IS HIGHLY unlikely that a new electrical engineer officer with a four year commitment as an electrical engineer will be allowed out to crosstrain into STO.

Thank you for that. I get the impression that even at the end of those four years, it is still unlikely that I'd be released.

I suppose I'll again look into enlisting. -and search for understanding of when I could attend OTS.

Another question: If I can become a STO, does it seem likely that ST would release me when I'm ready to settle down in Ohio(engr)? I've heard that ST is undermanned and likely to expand in years to come. And with the continuation bonuses, they clearly want to hold on to their guys.

I breezed through this thread, but I want to let you know that what Guard MC said sounds correct. Your college major doesn't matter so much as the AFSC you end up in.

For example, I majored in Electrical Engineering and I competed for and entered the AF as a pilot. In general, if you work hard enough, smart enough, and are persistent enough you can get what you want. The AF could care less what my bachelors degree is in at this point, only that I have one. What they do care about is the fact that they need competent pilots. Don't expect to get released from your career field once you start. If you do/can, it's a gift.

Some have indicated that majors like nursing may lock you into certain AFSCs. I didn't know that nursing was a bachelor's, but if it is I don't see why the AF would keep itself from potentially good officers because of their degree and desire to do a different job... on the other hand I would not be surprised if this is the case.

Enlist if that is what you want, but I don't see what that has to do with your major.

Use the OODA Loop: Observe, Orient, Decide, and Act. You've looked at STO. You know where you are and some of the actions you can take. Make decisions that align you with your goal. Execute the plan.

"But what about...?"

You can't eliminate risk. Gaining one career will mean losing another, and the risk will be there that you get neither. Go with your gut. Live without regrets.

Chris

As long as you meet your service obligation the Air Force cannot keep you unless they implement "stop loss" which is rare but did happen after 9/11 for certain AFSCs.